republicans have to give us an alternative. they've never done it. >> i agree. thank you. that is we will have that tomorrow. we are all over it. >> this strain of libertarianism is very dangerous. >> we are dangers to the status quo. >> libertarians are coming and we are skeptical of both parties. >> we have made these anarchy actions. >> come to a libertarian. ice. >> you live in a world of fear. >> more americans are now saying

that they are working longer. >> we work on a paper government that food and clothing. john: will be a successful libertarian political party? >> i'm not sure because some say organizing libertarians is not good. more young people are getting upset. the rise of a libertarian. that is our show coming up now. ♪ ♪ john: what the heck is libertarianism? i do know when i started reporting. i was just one more liberal and i knew that there were republicans and democrats and then there were the crazy people, but i have no idea that

there was a movement of people who want to honor the principles of liberty and limited government. who knew? it took me a long time to wake up and i will talk about that later in the show. but the good news is that more people have woke up in the gallup poll found most americans think the government is doing too much. good for them. after i woke up to the stupidity and the destructiveness of big government, i stumbled across this libertarian magazine. its motto is free the minds and free markets. taught me most about the benefits of liberty. we have editors nick gillespie and matt welch, editors at tremont. >> let's talk about the libertarian era. >> so far it has been a demonstration project of how democrats and conservatives can

screw things up and now we have the obama version and liberal democrat version of screwing everything up. so people understand that they are trying to control more and more parts of peoples lives and it doesn't work and are looking for an alternative and that is what libertarianism offers is the idea of free minds and free markets that you can control more parts of your life is the one i want to believe you, but i don't see many people getting into that. >> a shorthand for this can be fiscally conservative and socially tolerant. it will show you that americans are much more physically conservative than their elected representatives and a majority of americans think that we should balance the budget. they think that we should legalize marijuana, no one wants to talk about that,. >> but more are coming around? >> yes, they will come around last. and so when you have this, there's much more libertarianism and the government and you'll

begin to see some of these expressions in the political marketplace as well. john: all kinds of skepticism exists. and they are just considered odd at times including my colleagues >> even for a libertarian like you. >> that is what is happening. stossel doesn't care. so what is the hostility? >> part of it is that we have a two party -- a major two-party system in the country and people tend to special -- especially congregate around the republicans and they see everything through that. so you are by definition, you're on the other side is you make these choices burba. but the world is changing around them and people are more used to picking up issues instead of accepting everything that the party has. john: money defend bill o'reilly. he generally believes that to

legalize drugs, it is harmful. >> one of the things that is interesting is that he says you are dreaming up ideas and we invaded iraq based on a theory that cannot be turned out to be wrong. and the idea behind after he was we can go in there and create democracy in with enough like a soufflé and it didn't work and we are now suffering under obamacare and other types of financial regulations that are based upon very that have nothing to do with us. and then you go to the libertarian side of things and places like google or apple or whole foods and these are not theories the resource abstract concepts, these are the incarnations of the idea that people with freedoms they can do stuff and produce really interesting results. and that is a reality. >> pursuant to the drug war, people putting themselves -- the reality on the ground by almost everybody in the drug war has failed. >> i think americans confuse

libertarians and libertines. >> sometimes, that can be a problem. the fact is that you believe in social tolerance, you might have to put up with a lot of lifestyles that is yourself you might not choose. you get peace by allowing people to go after businesses and homes are not forcing it on other people and that means like sometimes you have to look away, that's not so bad. >> marijuana, drug drug legalization, that led and coulter to fit us. >> you want to suck up to your liberal friends and say we want to legalize pot and this is what libertarians are believed to be [bleep] [laughter] >> i do want to say that she is right. >> but in her words, which is a war against liberals and democrats, were not useful for her at all moments in there for we seem to be not part of it, she doesn't understand we are

not freely choosing to do this. but because we think a generally bad idea when the government gets between you and your decision, which is a conservative notion. and it is one that says the government can't solve your problems for you. but because she's a tribalist and fundamentally intolerant. she can't tolerate someone else's approach. i'm not part of her tribe and i never will be. >> it's also true that i think that libertarians care a lot about drug legalization because that is a very clear case of the government saying they cannot do this and you can't change your mind by ingesting this rather than that. and libertarians have been sounding the alarm about government spending, the size and spending go of government

and the uselessness of most interventions into everyday life is not just about caught. john: people claim organizing libertarians of her political party invite herding cats. don't let anyone tell you that it's easy. >> anyone can herd cattle. john: i was a great super bowl commercial. they have a point. the libertarian party has never done much of anything. >> that is true and the fact is that sometimes it has more than two parties basically there's always going to be two major parties because that's the way the system shakes out. a lot can change what is changing is that libertarian ideas, with the influence a lot of things i think we are starting to see that now. the tea party has been hammering

on the very libertarian theme libertarians seem that the government is spending too much. and that that has changed american politics and will continue to because simple math shows us that the government cannot go on spending the way that it has been spending. and libertarianism has a native appeal because it trustable to get on with their lives and are going to make mistakes. john: i disagree. >> there's a problem that needs a lot of solving soon after his that reaction. but it does give it a try, try out this in your life and see where you end up. >> many seem to believe that libertarians want chaos. here is a clip from the fox business network. >> if we put in total libertarian actions, there will be almost anarchy or mob rule. >> she wanted to widespread belief.

>> some people think were not an artistic enough. to develop theory moving government out of this and human flourishing will proceed. but i don't think that's the majority of libertarians. what we're trying to do is influence and take this that has been lumbering along this direction and then just sort of move it this way and get it so that it's not taking so much of our life and money she won the least a lot of the tea party people and some republicans seem to be coming around. >> i am listening to those independents. the libertarians who are saying that it is both sides of the aisle. leadership and that little voice in the party. >> five years ago, no one would've been talking about libertarians. >> i think it's great, and i think it's a sign. that this era is upon us and i think that we welcome people who

talk about being libertarians because that means that they are starting to engage in a new set of ideas. >> suddenly the democrats love the nsa, sometimes the republicans hate government spending in other that's wonderful when they go back into power. they don't love george w. bush, but they don't love barack obama either. john: a lot say we don't want sarah palin, she doesn't get it. some are skeptical that people like glenn back and he libertarian later on the show coming on air saying that we must reject the efforts and make it clear that we are not on the same team. >> i understand when somebody says, you know, i move in your direction. why would you instead of embracing them, why did i say

that we don't want to? i will give you this information [laughter] >> whoever's going to join me, not like i need to create a litmus test that they need to pass. because there might be non-libertarian datacom a data, log on westerberg is well in washington dc. and i think that americans understand that you go bit by bit in your oligarch everywhere and you should be on politics and policy as well. so glenn beck wants to go full libertarian, okay. john: thank you both for coming today. if you'd like to keep this conversation going, please go on social media, facebook, twitter, uses hash tag to let people know

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john: i could be wrong, but there seems to be more libertarians today, more people that care about the constitution and about limits on government power. why is this happening? because of me, of course. i'm ranted about this. finally, i have ranted and it has paid off. i have convinced more people and there are more republicans because of me. there was one of scare republican presidential candidate who is asked that. >> are you suggesting that we invited the 9/11 attacks? >> i'm suggesting that we listen to the people who attacked us and the reason that they did it. they are delighted that we are over there because osama bin laden has said that i'm glad you're over on art sand because we can target you easier and they have since that time killed

3400 of our men and i don't think it was necessary. >> that is an extraordinary statement. >> that's an extraordinary statement for someone to say we invited a because we were attacking iraq. i don't think i've ever heard that before. and i've heard some pretty absurd explanations for september 11. [cheers] [applause] john: rudy giuliani got the applause. but by that time, he was out of politics and ron paul are these calls at the rallies. >> you have been a part of this

large rally. >> are large rally, we had a dozen people coming out. and it is the message. because people criticize me all of the time. but the message is great. and i think what has happened is the absolute failure of our system is coming together. failure of foreign policy. and too much intrusion into our privacy. people see this as a message of liberty. they say that that makes sense. >> your colleagues thought that there was this weird annoyance. what is he talking about?

>> there's a lot that has happened. there's a bit of a surprise. >> people would sneer at me at times, and i got depressed about it. and people got very frustrated. and we have done a few peoples minds, changing their minds. >> the natural progress of things is for government to grow and liberty to yield. and what good is it to change as government keeps going.

>> there has to be a revolution. >> he actually lean towards a violent revolution. it has to be non-violated and young people have to be involved and i think that we are there. i think that we are in the middle of it and i think that what just happened -- >> we have so many people. just think of this recent vote but didn't happen on syria. republicans and democrats, grassroots, say no more war. at the same time, leadership in the house and the senate republicans and democrats were all for it. so the grassroots got together, you know, i don't like this idea were rebuffed compromise, you know, raise taxes and do this and that. but we have a coalition of people who call themselves libertarian conservatives who

are principled and they don't place the party at the top level. john: i'm surprised that a first-term senator, your son is already getting traction and more attention and people talk about him as a presidential candidate. >> i think that's very encouraging. i was pretty skeptical when he first announced it. and i thought, okay, but maybe it turned out much better. >> his popularity has grown. >> this is a sign of what is happening for sure. and, you know, just a mamas, he is in the house, and he has let that bill to try to rein in the house and we are seeing a lot of positive things happening. john: thank you. coming up, libertarians versus social conservatives.

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>> we have extended ourselves too far around the world and we have gotten involved in these wars that are unconstitutional and they have never been declared, we don't know why we are there and we don't know when they are overcome is the most important thing that a new president can do is bring our troops home. [cheers] [applause] john: it sounds good to me. we have troops in korea and japan, italy, germany, we are deep in debt, but we spend 700 billion and it's too much. but i am told that i'm clueless when i say things like that. >> we are not naïve and he is

deluded about the importance of the american military allegory and this includes the global economy without the military precedents around the world. international trade would be constructed. john: everyone is freeloading off of us and we cannot afford it. >> it is worth every penny because it helps united states benefit to have this global economy and that is why bringing the boys home is important. he wants to shut down all of the bases. john: i would argue that the economy would do just fine if we did not have 60,000 soldiers in

germany. >> we did have 300,000 there and what that was crucial to have them there. they protected western europe for 50 years. john: that was then. troops are in korea now. that is now. john: south korea's economy is bigger as well. >> the entire economy goes to the m economy goes to the military. but it is certainly the responsibility that america has taken on for good reason and it's done by military presence around the world. >> teeple may say that they criticize the united states and at the end of the day they want to be protected by the american military as well. >> a lot of asian countries do and nothing that happens

internationally in the world without the united states leading the way and one way does so is with its presence. >> they made a lot of enemies in afghanistan. we armed the wrong side and we have gone to iraq twice. >> i wouldn't say winning, so what what do you think? we can help to create osama bin laden? >> i don't think so. john: okay, the stirring of libertarianism that is going to both parties right now, i think it is a very dangerous thought, he said. when rand paul talked about the president's drone policy, they called us wacko birds. >> rand paul said that congress

has basically abdicated its role of foreign policy. and i think you've made a good point on that. john: okay, let's move on. the rise of a libertarian. >> i would call it a blip. not much of that. the libertarian party. a. john: the. john: you have said without embracing social issues like abortion and drugs and gay marriage, conservative philosophy can never become a majority. we still believe that? >> when i think that i said was that that group is central to the republican party and i hear lots of people say that they are terrible, they are scaring people away and you can't win without them. >> the way for them to win is to welcome us and it's a lot bigger

than the libertarian wing. stephen chris christie, what about him? >> he is opposed, but he didn't issue a court appeal and is basically a pro-lifer. john: okay, the parity of ron paul, what is the point? >> is the lovable prank. we parity everyone. and i'm sure that rand paul has a sense of humor. you know, he does these things. >> but it's not the role of congress. >> i will bet you that if he saa

great chuckle. john: thank you so much, fred barnes. coming up, a libertarian celebrity. celebrity. that's coming up huh, fifteen minutes could save you fifteen percent or more on car insurance. everybody knows that. well, did you know that when a tree falls in the forest and no one's around, it does make a sound? ohhh...ohhh...oh boy! i'm falling. everybody look out! ahhhhh...ugh. little help here. geico. fifteen minutes could save you...well, you know. anybody?

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john: are you a republican? democrat? [cheers] [cheers] john: your proponents of? to liberty. [cheers] [cheers] >> students for liberty are very clear about not calling themselves democrats or republicans. and that the group did not exist a few years ago. it was started by alexander

mccobin. >> i realized that i was libertarian since a very young age. >> so you were reared in high school? >> yes, when i got to college, i realized that i was aware that i didn't need another person about the same way as me the first two years. >> within a year we had over 200 members on our roster. students, professors came out of the woodwork, and i realized that there had always been libertarians on my campus and we had no way of identifying one another until there was a student group that could bring us together. the. john: you held your first conference at columbia.

300, 500, more than a thousand. we are comparing it to the national convention of the young democrats and college republicans and you get more students now. >> i truly think this is the libertarian generation of young people have grown up socially tolerant but skeptical of the economy. >> i think that the majority you have libertarian leanings but they are not aware of what it means to be a libertarian. >> and i think that what we are seeing is that young people are very interested in the idea of liberty. there are republicans and democrats in the present him with this idea of libertarianism and they are very open to it and very interested. something that really hits a chord with young people who were not interested in we don't want government hand in my pocket.

especially as we see students really getting involved in this message. john: are your parents libertarian? >> we were hesitant to believe that i was hesitant to believe in high school. and everything changed. >> i'm an immigrant from argentina and i have always had ideas about the condition of immigrants in america and improving the lives of all people. >> i came to the realization that there is no better way to achieve the ends of prosperity for all people that libertarianism is the one which has more government of

libertarianism? argentina or the united states? >> we are running conferences about europe this fall. we ran a conference in venezuela at the beginning of this year. many of them had over 350 attendees. >> how do they get the concept? >> americans don't. >> i think a lot of americans do, especially young people in america. the other great thing is that with the internet, people have access towards communicating and connecting with each other in ways that we never could have before. students for liberty would not have been around. john:

>> professors? >> professors are a different case. some of them say liberty is not very applicable around the world. if our ideas were implemented, then the world would be chaotic. >> what we are seeing is the perfect storm, people have grown up where we have widespread government surveillance and historically low approval ratings of government and we have this innovation versus archaic government and young people are saying no but i'm choosing entrepreneurs and innovators in this is how we are going to find a solution today in a more free society. one i hope you are right. so coming up, some celebrities

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>> if you live in a free country, you have the right to put anything you want into your own body. and anything else is bull. the one that was penn gillette n this famous magician has taken a stance is on libertarian issues, like the war on drugs and constitution and the size of government. penn jillette and his partner, keller, are libertarians. so what brought you around, penn jillette? >> i was brought around to libertarianism by good old-fashioned argument. my friend kept saying, you are wrong. absolutely. because it was done with

complete respect. and i would say something and he would make a counter argument and it was compelling. after about four hours he got me thinking. you have to go through that reading. and there's a lot of stuff that he recommended and all of that stuff you expect to read. and then very shortly after that kerry ran, who is a wonderful man, what gravity is that i am very much against fighting. i'm a complete pacifist. i remember when they had the ohio museum with a crucifix in

the art piece, which i thought was great. my mom and dad didn't like that. they were christians. and that being paid for by their tax money. they put me in an awkward position. john: people don't get that connection. >> yes, so my feeling is that we need taxes for certain things and the idea of a private police force is very frightening and we don't want to do that. but i will work so hard to help you build a library, but building this at gunpoint, saying that we need this badly, we are going to put this, it's the basis of libertarianism today. not using force and it's a great

feeling and many people think that's a good idea, the government should do it. but the real answer is that can do it without that. >> it puts me in the opposition that never had a sip of alcohol or any drug in my life, but i was on the cover of high times magazine. i believe that we need to have those freedoms. but that's another hard thing to get across is that most of the freedoms that argued for have no desire to use for myself, but i want other people to be able to come even if it's stupid, i think libertarianism is the right to be stupid. john: on the show i try to point out that government doesn't work but free markets do, but you told the daily caller that i have no evidence that libertarianism to a better life and i just think it is morally

right. >> it was a fascinating idea. and it really is true. >> is poverty in their spending one's. >> i just think that freedom itself is the idea that each individual can do what they want, the most power possible without hurting other people. and i also just don't want to use force, that is the whole thing. i will argue maybe you shouldn't be doing heroin, but i don't want the government can come in and use force for that. >> disproportionately is supported by religious people and get your book is just out in paperback. every day is an atheist holiday. so what is the libertarian and a disconnection? >> i'm a strong libertarian and a strong atheist. i know and respect christian libertarians. and i know and respect atheist

liberals. and those don't necessarily go together, but in my mind they do go together like an incredible self-respect of self-reliance. >> i do think that we need this and we need to work government in there. and it was a question i was asked, one in five people is poor and what does that mean to you and i said that that means that there were people that can help them. there are four of us. john: coming up, my take on the rise of the day we rescued riley, was a truly amazing day. without angie's list, i don't know if we could have found all the services we needed for our riley. for over 18 years we've helped people take care of the things that matter most. join today at angieslist.com

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john: pc that's? are they an impressive? these are the 19 enemies that i want one i was one more liberal consumer report. >> john stossel, channel two news at. >> i criticize business, called for government regulation to protect you from ads like this one. and the world's smallest air-conditioner. >> we tried it out in the smallest room we could find, we ran air-conditioner for half an hour in the telephone booth and it went up 2 degrees. >> what a rip off. there ought to be a law or rule or government way to stop scams

like that sometimes politicians pass laws because of my reporting. once they created a department of consumer affairs after my exposé. and i want more emmys but then i stayed and watched regulators work and i watched politicians brag about laws like osha and the occupational safety and health law. and they showed this chart and thank goodness for government regulation. except when it took time to check this out the slope of the line was about the same. when people are free, it gets better without endless rule as we get richer and people care more about safety. so governments pretend that they

lead the parade. free markets save more lives in government ever well. and government regulation fails and fails again and it makes everything costs more. so despite all of the new rules, still pushing and you have won a prize spam and regulators have said that we will fix that. but they did not. and i left local television to join good morning america and i discover that there aren't that many really big national things, i found plenty of nasty things going on in portland, oregon. here in new york city as well. once i was on a national stage, i found few large-scale things because of the free market. the companies that got rich were the ones that serve customers pretty well. market competition, rewarding

good ones and better than government. so i really should put these emmys in the garbage. i got this because economically inert people give out these awards and i should be ashamed of these. fortunately, i read more economics and became a libertarian i saw the wonderful things that happened when government leaders on. and it's also the cult regulation is bad. and it gives people information and anyway, most of you are smarter than me and you figure figured that out without having to do years of consumer

reporting. and it is best in government backs off and allows people to do something peaceful. that is our show, have a great . fox news sunday is up next.eat . >> i'm chris wallace. low enrollment numbers and millions of cancels policies have the obama white house on the ropes. >> we did fumble the ball on it. what i'm going to do is make sure that we get it fixed. >> the so-called fix isn't impressing insurance industry leaders or regulators. we'll talk with the head of america's health insurance plans karen ingagni and also ben nelson and our panel weighs in on the uphill battle to rescue obama care and in wyoming, a bitter republican primary between an